Managing Online Communities in the Disability Space with Deborah Jaffe
Deborah Jaffe is our guest today and she joins the program to talk about the two disability focused Facebook groups of which she is the creator and admin. She talks with Mai Ling about how the groups got started and the steps required to manage them and keep engagement alive. Deborah also shares how she filters through news stories, helpful info, tips, etc. to find what is applicable to the members of the groups. This information is valuable to anyone looking to build a community in the disability space.
Contact Mai Ling: MLC at mailingchan.com
Contact Martyn: Martyn at martynsibley.com
It's a team effort. We are all in this together. If we work together, if we collaborate together, I think we can accomplish a many great things much more than just by ourselves. Because we all have something to offer. We all have something to contribute.
Mai Ling 00:18
Welcome to exceptional leaders with Mai Ling and Martin, where we give you front row access to intimate conversations that are shaping the way the world is supporting people with disabilities. If it's happening, it's being shared here. I'm Mai Ling
And I'm Martyn Sibley. And today we're going to be chatting about Deborah Jaffe, and around resilience and altruism. And in very particular sense, Deborah is very involved in Facebook group, in fact, more than one Facebook group, and does a lot of great work for disabled community in terms of community building, giving kind of help and advice. And I think the fact we just mentioned this word, altruism is what really struck me the most about her story, but what are your thoughts on it, Mai Ling?
Mai Ling 01:00
Yes, I've known Deb for a while, I've been following her on Facebook with all of her posts, and she actually informs me for a lot of my posts. So, I ended up re sharing a lot of the things that she shares. She is everywhere, Martyn, she really is she's somebody that is really following these keywords, following people following topics. If you want to know what's going on in the disability community, I highly suggest that you follow one of her two Facebook groups. But I want to go back to the word altruism. You know, we always say that that's a common thread of people who are entrepreneurs, in the disability community, would you agree?
Yeah, yeah, we've talked a few times about the kind of the mission and the passion. And I think any sort of entrepreneurial story and advice actually will always speak about, you know, if it's only about the money, it's sort of almost a negative sense to kind of, I want to be an entrepreneur, because I just want to make an arbitrary amount of money because I want lots of money, it tends to not be sustainable, that you, you need to really have that passion. So, fueling, fueling you through the hard times. And again, of course, that the money side is a good part of it. And we all hope to build wealth at the same time. But I think definitely looking at my journey and the disability community, there's this social issue around the exclusion of disabled people. And so, I think there's just always this underlying current of just wanting to help others and help make a difference and impact people in the world positively. So, I totally agree that altruism is very much part of the disability entrepreneurship route and are very much in the book that we were coauthors of, that you pulled together. And yeah, I think Deborah's stories is fascinating to really epitomize that part of it.
Mai Ling 02:52
Yeah, it's in our DNA. And we don't use words like monetize passive streams of income, although I do a lot of my coaching to get people to think like that. But honestly, I was really surprised to hear from Deb that she really does not have any offerings, anything. So, you know, as our listeners going through her story, I really want you to think about all of the time and the intense passion and commitment that she's putting into this to support the Facebook groups and that there is no monetization route. And I will use this podcast as an example, I did the 51 episodes myself, which was one year of shows. And then now Martyn and I have completed a year we're rounding up into our second. And this is not a monetized show. So, you know, we don't ask for any money, any donations. We don't do any sponsored mid rolls or anything like that. And it's part of the giving, and I feel so good about that. And I'm sure you do, too, Martyn.
No, absolutely. Absolutely. Is it definitely the passion shines through between us and all the amazing people, we get to meet, we we enjoy it. But most of all, we enjoy that opportunity to contribute and give back and the other word we mentioned around resilience. I did a live stream yesterday. I appreciate when this goes out. It might be not so much yesterday, but in terms of as we're speaking at the moment, it was yesterday. And it was about bouncing back from setbacks and negativity. And I think that's the other part of this. That's interesting. I think there was a story around being locked out of one of the Facebook groups and here when if it's not your day job and you're an employee running a Facebook group, and as you said before, maybe you know, if you were monetizing from that sort of community, you may be more driven to keep going but that was the instance, you know she didn't have that economic gain. And yet she stayed resilient and she innovated and she pivoted and all that stuff that good stuff we talk about, but I think we know resilience is a really good trait as well at the disability community and I think that's epitomized in today's story as well.
Mai Ling 04:59
So before we get to the interview, I think it's, we always have to have a little catch up and how things are going in our world. And I, I hear you've had some big news that you'd like to share. Really?
Mai Ling 05:11
Yes, I'm talking about resilience. I, I had a big failure. I say it's a failure. Of course, everybody on the outside are like, No, you know, it's a positive experience. But, you know, for me, I had created YappGuru (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENL3Zk8664Y) and I thought that was gonna be it. This was it, like, this is what you do, you put it in caps, you know, this is the one thing that I'm gonna create, and it's going to take off and, you know, everything's gonna be beautiful, and rainbows around it. And I had just a, just hard, difficult challenges and, and just a lot of decisions that we had to make. And we ended up closing it down. And I just was on the floor, crying, Martyn, you know, I'm a failure, and it's public. And everybody sees that, you know, I tried to create something, it didn't work. And that's it, I'm just gonna expire right here. And guess what, that did not happen. And out of it is like the Phoenix, you know, out of it came this amazing opportunity with people that were already in my life and in my world. And we were able to put together XceptionalEd (https://xceptionaled.com/). And now two years later, it is a global offering. We have 33,000 students that have signed on and have taken courses with us. We have 60 people who are creating courses as thought leaders in the special education disability space. And a company has seen our value and they acquired us meaning like our team is now part of their teams something bigger. And as you know, this, I know, Martyn, you've had your own acquisition with Accomable(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accomable) to Airbnb, it was just this feeling of like, we found our family now, you know, and we found the people that can do the things for the company that we weren't able to do, which I wholeheartedly say, and I hope that our listeners listening to this too, you can't do everything, you can't with a T. Martyn, and I think we can, but it's only when we realize that we can't, that we're able to grow bigger, and to help more people and to help the people that are working with us to grow bigger. I can't even tell you how elated all of us are. So yes, it's big news. We're really excited. And I can't wait to share the new and improved XEd with everybody. The company that acquired us is called Verge Learning (https://learnwithverge.com/). And it is a teletherapy platform. so unique. I'm so excited for anybody who's in special education, you have to check it out, because it's like zoom specifically for special needs and special education.
Amazing. First, and most of all, congratulations, I think we've generally had this chat about, we don't often as people stop and really, truly have gratitude for our achievements and successes. And it's important to actively do that. So yeah, most of all, massive congratulations. I'm really excited for the next chapter with one of your businesses, one of your projects. And I think that point you made about when you think something is it, and it ends up not being it, I almost slipped back on a couple of failed ventures I had that. You always need that naivety to embark on this kind of crazy entrepreneurial venture. And you learn so much from the failures. And then when you go again, because eventually there is always another idea or another opportunity to chase down. There's maybe less of that crazy dream. And this is still the dream and the excitement. But I definitely think for me that sort of second, third, fourth or fifth time, so different projects and businesses, there was just a calmer confidence. And I think in the end, that's where you go on to the next one, and they're more likely to succeed. So, there's definitely a message about failure is an opportunity to grow and move on to new things is a broader point I would take out of what you were saying before. There's also a lot around how to exit with a company that I believe we're going to be doing an episode on. So if anyone's interested in that particular topic, whether it's a general thing they'd like to hear more about whether you've actually got a company and it's something that's kind of on your radar, and you'd like to get a bit more support. We're going to be doing a whole episode on that. So, stay tuned. Is there anything you want to add to that before we move on to the next part, Mai Ling?
Mai Ling 09:13
Yeah, I just want to plug Martyn really quickly. So in 2016, he was named the third most influential person with a disability in Britain and you know, I have always had this like starry eyed fan girl thing for Martyn and I get to call him my podcast hubby now, but I highly recommend that you follow us and subscribe and listen, which is free just so you know, but listen to our episode on March 8 exit strategies with Mai Ling and Martin because now I have something to add, but Martyn's is bigger than mine. So, I really think it'll be pretty valuable for you.
Awesome. Cool. Finally, before we move into the main event and the interview, it's the regular shoutout for you listeners, you lovely listeners to get engaged with us. So, you know the usual hotspots we are on Facebook and Instagram. Xceptionalleaders.com, where you can sign up for our new mailing list, which is very, very exciting for all the latest news and events and discounts and all that good stuff. But yeah, most of all, just please do engage with us follow, like, share. And also, if you're on podcast, like the Apple podcast, for example, we really, really would love more reviews, we did a shout out in the last episode, but it would be really great to hear your thoughts on the podcast, or what's useful what you like about it. And yeah, we're just trying to reach more people and get more positivity and positive impact out there. So really, really appreciate if you can help out in that way for us.
Mai Ling 10:39
Yes, and I also want to talk about clubhouse. If you guys have heard about it, it's like the who's who. It's VIP only, there's a waitlist, and it's only available on Apple platform, so the iPhone or the iPad. But if you are a speech language pathologist, I can get you in without having to be on the waitlist. So definitely reach out to me, I'm on Instagram Mai Ling Chan, am on Facebook, whatever, just reach out to me, let me know you are a speech language pathologists and I can connect with you on getting past the waitlist, I feel so important. And then if you are interested in getting on and you are not an SLP definitely reach out to me too, because I earn invites, and you will too. So, I can extend those to you when I have them. So, it's the place to be and Martyn and I are going to start doing some special interviews and features there. I am also starting a room called exceptional entrepreneurs, which is very in line with what we do. So, we want you to be a part of that there too.
Yeah, no, see, I'm just chatting over with Mai Ling that I'm on Android. So, I'm waiting eagerly for it to come out on Android, but I just wanted to make a broader point. And I'm hearing the chatter. And it's definitely given me FOMO. Like what, what is this clubhouse thing, it looks amazing. But also, from a marketing perspective. It really reminds me of how Facebook took off that sense of belonging. And being in the cool club with the cool kids and the VIP vibe. I think it's very, very clever marketing strategy, that clubhouse have deployed. So slightly geeky marketing comment there, but I just wanted to share that as well.
Mai Ling 12:11
I love it. Well, I think that we are ready to share Deborah Jaffe with everyone. What do you think?
Let's do it. Enjoy everyone.
Mai Ling 12:23
So today, I'm really excited to have Deborah Jaffe with me. She is one of those people that has embraced Facebook and I know what you're gonna think, you know, Facebook is just blown up and it's overpopulated and people are posting stuff, you know, like about their food and, you know, random thoughts. But the reason why I have been really chasing Debra down for probably about a year now to join me as a guest is because she's using it the way that it's supposed to be used. So, I'd like to welcome Deborah Jaffe.
Hi, thanks for having me. I appreciate being on.
Mai Ling 12:54
You know what I'm so excited to see your face because I see your posts all the time. And obviously hear your words and your feedback. And this is just a fan Girling right now, so thank you.
Oh, well, thank you. You flatter me. It's you know, it's not just me by myself. It's something that I do with other people. It's a team effort. I think we all can make a difference, especially when we work together.
Mai Ling 13:15
I love that and I hear your accent. Where are you from on the east.
I live in New Jersey. I'm a South Jersey girl.
Mai Ling 13:23
Yay. I'm a jersey girl too. I lived at exit 117 off the parkway, Keyport, New Jersey until I was 29 and then now moved out west but I love my Jersey accents and my Jersey sleeps.
Jersey is a great place a little bit expensive. But I'm I've been here my whole life so.
Mai Ling 13:42
Fantastic. All right. Well tell us a little bit about your two Facebook groups, Friends of People with Disabilities (https://www.facebook.com/groups/691931344685385) and Friends of Children with Special Needs (https://www.facebook.com/fcsn1996/).
Okay, well, the first one the Friends of children with special needs. That was my original group. That's my baby. I started that. Five years ago, I was working at a school for children with special needs. And I turned 50 in the same year that the school had their 50th year of service. And I wanted to honor that by doing something special. I wanted to do something for the kids. So, I did this little like a GoFundMe, like a fundraiser type thing. I wanted to raise money for the school in lieu of gifts like that was like my gift. I figured it would be something temporary, but then it just took on a life of its own. It just grew exponentially. I saw there was a huge interest. So, I said well, even after the fundraising is done, and I don't even work at that school anymore. I just fell in love with the idea of making a difference. And it was one way that I could facilitate that. My second group actually was born out of a little frustration because Facebook is great. Technology is great. But there's sometimes there are technical issues and I was so frustrated with Facebook because I was having issues where I couldn't really access my group. They went on for quite some time and I That's so exasperate. I said, Oh, no, I still want to do this. So, what can I do? So, I created another group, that's Friends of People with Disabilities. And then I actually got access to my original group that so now I figure I'll just manage both. And it's good because it increases my reach. And one is kind of more for children. And one is more for just people in general, maybe more adults. And I just managed both at this point, and they just keep growing. So as long as they keep growing, and I can keep doing it, I'm gonna keep doing it.
Mai Ling 15:28
That's fantastic. So, what year did you start your first group?
I think it was 2015. Or maybe it was 2016. So, I've been doing it for a while now.
Mai Ling 15:37
Yeah. Okay. And it's really interesting that this started with something that was very local, very specific. And now, Deb, I believe you're pretty International. When you say,
Yes, I mean, I don't like to brag, but my groups combined are about 5000 members. And I have people from all over the world, in my groups. And I take great pride in that. Because that's thing to me about social media, you have the power to reach so many people that you couldn't reach otherwise. And it's like, it's a good platform for that. It's like having a megaphone, and you can just get that message out. And it's a positive one. It's like, hey, there's a sense of community here. You're not alone. You can join these groups, you get support, I try to share information that I think is pertinent. I connect people, sometimes actual people connect. It's like a networking type thing, where people need services or other resources, so they can come to that group. And it gives them a myriad of choices where maybe they wouldn't have access to those things if it wasn't for social media.
Mai Ling 16:39
So, here's the big question. Is it monetized?
No, no, not at all. There's no money involved. As far as joining. It's all free. I do this on a volunteer basis. I've never sought out any type of compensation for I do it with all love in my heart, just try to help people.
Mai Ling [Sponsor Ad] 16:59
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Mai Ling 17:50
Now, let's get back to our amazing interview. You were recently recognized; can you share that?
Oh, oh, my goodness. Well, I've gotten several awards and recognition. Thank you for asking the Points of Light organization (https://www.pointsoflight.org/), which was started by the first President Bush, George HW Bush started that organization to recognize volunteer work, and I got an award from them (https://www.pointsoflight.org/awards/deborah-jaffe-daily-point-of-light/). My second award was more of a local award that was called Heartland Hero Award, which is more like New Jersey, particularly South Jersey type award. So, I was I was featured in a local newspaper for that (https://njheartland.org/deborah-jaffe/). And so, I've gotten some recognition. I don't brag about it. But I do like the fact that does help me to spread the message. Because I feel like if people know about what I'm trying to do, and the work that I'm trying to do with these groups, then it gets the message across that much more.
Mai Ling 18:48
So, I can't even put into words how prolific you are with your posting, I feel like you're everywhere all the time. And I see stuff and you know, you put it up there. I'm just like, gotcha, how do you so how do you stay in touch with all of these? Like I said, keywords, specific people, international news. I mean, the list goes on how are you really on the cutting edge of all of that?
Well, this is again, where my I guess I have some good networking skills, because I'm also on LinkedIn, which is a professional site. And if I do say, so I have a lot of connections there I have last count was over 18,000 connections on LinkedIn. And I'm mostly the people I'm connected to are also in the disability community or in the education community. So, it's a collaborative effort. Like I said, at the top of the show, I get information from people they share with me, I share with them you know, we exchange and sometimes I'm actually in touch with these people. Sometimes it's more just following what they post, and I have permission to take what I want and just pass it along because they also are trying to get the word out. So, it's kind of a chain reaction like a domino effect. They share it then I share it so that that's how I get a lot of my information is just from these various sources, other people who also are in the loop.
Mai Ling 20:06
Right? Can you tell us a little bit about the types of posts that you share? And how many posts do you typically share in a day?
It varies. I try to be on top of it, I do try to post every day, usually multiple times in a day, I post all kinds of things. I'll post this there. It could be something from an informative webinar, it could be just oh, by the way, this is legislation that was passed that affects people with disabilities. Oh, look, here's a feel-good inspirational story, just because little positivity is really important, especially these days. It's just like, again, myriad of things based on whatever source I'm taking it from. And it's anything for FYI, you know, for your information. Or here's a service that might be of interest to you, or a product that might be interesting to you or useful. So, it just depends what I come across. But I try every day to post something.
Mai Ling 20:59
And how do you filter? You know, I've come across that myself too, is people will send me stuff. And you know, there still is a subjective component to it like that. You need to be responsible for making sure that it is real information, factual, I don't know if you go delve into evidence-based research. But how do you make those selections
Well, all posts are reviewed before I allow them, I don't just let them go without reviewing them. And I do actually review them. If it's something that's not straightforward. And there's a question, I will do some research. If it's too questionable, I may actually decline it. I don't necessarily accept all members. I don't necessarily accept all posts. I am discriminatory. Because I realized that in this climate, some people may be off to things that are little nefarious, and I am very diligent about keeping that out of my groups.
Mai Ling 21:50
Yeah. And not to bring up a sore spot. But can you just share with us because I think we all have groups that we are very careful about. And of course, we're protective about we've built them to a certain number. Could you share with us what the trigger was where you had your issue with administrative access to your Facebook group?
Oh, it's really, it's actually kind of funny, because there's messenger as well, which is a separate thing. And again, this is where people sometimes take too many liberties. I don't mind getting messages on messenger because it is one way to reach me. But some people do not use it appropriately. I was getting unwanted contact from people who have no business contacting me. And they were using messenger to do it. So, I decided I did not want messenger anymore. But it was hard, because I also didn't want to shut that door because I have legitimate correspondence on messenger. So, it was me trying to eliminate the option to just only make the button. So, people couldn't click on the message button and get a hold of me. I actually watched the YouTube video telling me do this do that. I did this. I did that. And next thing I know I was locked down Facebook.
Mai Ling 23:01
Just that simple. I said, What did I do? I told you technology and I it's a work in progress. It really is. I try I really do try.
Mai Ling 23:19
You know, it's funny because I would actually like, I'll help my mom with something. And she's always like, you know, can I do this? Can I do that? And I'm like, Mom, you can't break it, you know, and just play around. And then something like this happens. And I'm like, Oh, no.
Oh, and it's so it went on for a very long time went on for months, and I can't talk to Facebook so many times. And then I was able to gain access to as I have another lovely member who was not a technophobe, like I am, more tech savvy. He did. And I and Ron, he, like invited me to be an administrator. So now I'm an administrator again. So thankfully, I was I was hard sick. I mean, I really was upset because that was 1000s of people that I wanted to help. And I couldn't even send them a message to say, Oh, I'm sorry, I can't administrate to the group right now I can't communicate with you. Because all the all the posts are pending. So, if I tried to post, it was who was going to approve it, there was nobody else to approve it. So, I've gotten smart. I've appointed a few other administrators in case something happens now. So, I've got that covered. Now.
Mai Ling 24:23
That's a good point. I really thank you for bringing that up. Because a lot of times we don't think about that. You know we; we have a group; we grow a group and you're the one that's moderating it. And then something might happen even if it's, you know, just within your family or you have to come on Facebook, you should have some type of backup. Right. So, thank you for sharing that. How many people do you have in each of the groups now?
My original group is, I don't know it's 3800. And something I'm not sure the exact it's definitely over 3800. My new group is now up to about 900
Mai Ling 24:55
That's excellent and then the second one is just in a couple months, right?
That's correct I did not start that until sometime in June, I think it was.
Mai Ling 25:03
And again, you don't do any paid advertising, right?
No. Absolutely not. No. Not at all.
Mai Ling 25:09
And do you just allow everybody to become a member of these groups? Or are you asking preliminary questions,
There are preliminary questions that must be asked. And that's again, how I try to weed out people who they could be a bot, not even a real person, which I know also happens, there's people up to no good maybe trying to hack or this or that. And you have to be unfortunately, you have to be suspicious a little bit, I I'm a very open person. But in this day and age, unfortunately, you can't be totally trusting that way, you do have to make sure you vet the people as well as possible.
Mai Ling 25:43
Absolutely. So you're personally curating all of the members of both of these groups, you're out there getting the information, filtering the information, reading, obviously, you've read it before you posted, I love when you're posting about the people that I've come in contact with whether they are previous guests on my podcast, or friends of mine, it's just fantastic. It's definitely like, you start to realize it, like everybody knows everybody somehow in this community, right? And, and definitely, I have benefited from your posts, because that's where I will follow the trail, find the person, and then stalk them to get them to be a guest on the show.
Well, and that's the whole point is it is I'm gonna say this for the third time, it's a team effort. We are all in this together. If we work together, if we collaborate together, I think we can accomplish a many great things much more than just by ourselves. Because we all have something to offer. We all have something to contribute.
Mai Ling 26:37
Absolutely. So, let me ask you, how much time do you think you're putting in to these two offerings during a week?
Well, if you asked my husband, an awful lot. It doesn't feel like it to me, I think only because I'm so passionate that I enjoy it. But I do believe I spent a decent amount of time doing it. Because I I feel like you know, I'll come across things that will come across more things. It's, it's over like a rabbit hole. You know, I do my research, I come across things then I'm like wait a minute, Oh, and it leads to this, oh, leads to that. And I just keep coming across more and more information, I want to share it with everyone, I'm very excited to share it with people. So, I think I do spend a decent amount of time trying to get that information out. And I do interact with members many times, either on that lovely messenger that I don't like.
Mai Ling 27:24
That you deleted.
Or even in the group itself, people will ask me a question or this or that, and I try to devote as much time as I'm capable of doing.
Mai Ling 27:33
Well, this is wonderful. I want to personally thank you because like I said, I have benefited, and I know that other people have too, that I've sent them, you know, to your community for either information or to try to help, you know, get their platform shared. And it's just been wonderful. Let me ask you, what is your long-term goal with this?
Well, it's funny because I've had offers that have been extended to me as a result of these groups. I was offered a radio show at one point, or a podcast, first thing I would do what you're doing, actually.
Mai Ling 28:01
I've been offered several things. I was even invited to be on the board of directors for one organization. But you know, it's funny, I have to be kind of selective about how thinly I spread myself. Because I think if you overdo things and overextend yourself, then you can't accomplish anything, because you're just going in so many different directions. So, for right now, I've focused on my groups. I have considered some of the other offers but there's so many things going on in my personal life as well. My daughter is in the air force, she is stationed in Korea. And everything is in flux. With that. You mentioned that I live in New Jersey, we've actually been talking about moving to Hawaii of all places.
Mai Ling 28:44
Yeah. So, there's so many things going on personally, that I if I overextend myself or make too many commitments, you know, it's like, what direction do I go. And so, I try to put a lot of my focus just in this for right now. Because it's my passion. I think I am accomplishing a lot just for that. And if it leads to other things, even if it's not a New Jersey, if it's in Hawaii, or wherever it is, you know, with social media, I can get to people wherever I live, I can reach people, you know, like the way we're speaking. Now, I could speak to you just the same way if I was living in Hawaii, and that's the beauty of it.
Mai Ling 29:18
Exactly, exactly. So, what do you do outside of this?
I was working at that school. And then when my daughter first went into the Air Force, there was a lot of time spent. I had to go out of state several times and there was a lot of traveling. And then I just started to go back to working with children in the school. And then the pandemic hit. Yes So my husband's like, well, maybe when the pandemic settles down, and then now the talk of moving so I've told my husband if we stay here, I will definitely go back to work maybe at the school where I was or maybe a different one. If we move, then I'll probably do the same thing, but it'll be where I live which I can see myself working in a school in paradise. I think I could live with that.
Mai Ling 30:00
O gosh, yes.
But I would like to work with children again, because I do love children, I do love working with them. That was my favorite part of the job. I loved working with those children, it was so satisfying, so rewarding. It really was inspiring for me. And that's what got the ball rolling in the first place. So, and, you know, everybody says about how, you know, you help them you're doing for them, but I think they helped me and did for me as much as I did.
Mai Ling 30:25
Yes. Oh, I love that. I love that. Well, you know, it's a blessing that we've had this extra time with you because then you can continue to grow and really just be a huge resource for us and for the community. So, I want to thank you for that. How can we stay in touch with you? And can you tell us again, the names of those Facebook groups?
Well, you can certainly be in touch with me by joining my friends of children with special needs group or my friends with people with disabilities group, which are those Facebook groups, I am on messenger reluctantly. If you want to visit my profile on Facebook, it's Deborah Jaffe, if you want to connect with me on LinkedIn, which is the professional site, I'm also on there. So, I'm also reachable there, I'll be happy to connect with anyone who's interested in connecting on those platforms.
Mai Ling 31:12
Excellent. Thank you, again, for joining us, Deb. And it's just like I said, wonderful. I'm interviewing her on the zoom platform, so I get to actually see her. But you know, your voice is very clear on all of your posts and your follow ups. And you're just so active out there. And again, I just want to thank you for everything you're doing.
Oh, you know what, it's likewise, thank you for what you do. You also do a lot for the disability community. And it's been an honor and a pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Mai Ling 31:37
It was my absolute pleasure. Thanks so much for joining us for this episode, and I invite you to connect with me directly at mailingchan.com. We also want you to let us know what you think about the show, ideas and how we can continue to help you or referrals to a great guest through our Facebook group at Exceptional Leaders Podcast or email us at email@example.com
Yes, Mai Ling I totally agree to that I know we're both really mission driven people. And for me, it's always been this big mission to have a world that's fully inclusive for all people. And in the end, that's probably why we've bonded and come together, so well on this podcast, exceptional leaders podcast (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/xceptional-leaders-with-mai-ling-chan-martyn-sibley/id1435433350), because we get to meet cool people, give them a platform to share their story and really just make such an impact in the disability world. I love it. Also, for everyone listening please do head over to disabilityhorizons.com. This is the magazine that I co-founded about 10 years ago and we've got a free mailing list there for all the latest article news and discounts for the shop if that's your kind of thing. And definitely, definitely do get your copy of the Becoming an Exceptional Leader book. We want you to get as much information as you need and to be as successful as you can be.
I am a professional, devoted advocate for my students, and I am always willing to do whatever is necessary to ensure that they have the best educational experience possible. I am also experienced in quality assurance, so accurate observation and documentation are part of my larger skill set.